[–] tavavex 10 hours ago
[–] Arnt 9 hours ago
Producing "trump is …" when a user wants that is one thing. Producing that when the user wants something else could be construed as coming from the software itself, and we all know that people looking for a shitstorm will seize the opportunity.
So probabilistic software like a swipe interpreter will often be written to avoid some guesses, to lessen the chance of a shitstorm. Users who want that output have to use a dependable input method instead of one based on probabilities and guesswork.
IMO this avoidance isn't among the ten worst consequences of shitstorms.
[–] howunfortunate 8 hours ago
This would probably be a bad customer experience for many people, even if Apple could prove these are simply the most common n-gram completions.
And if they altered their training data to avoid completions that are politically unpalatable, IMO that's actually much much worse than a grey list.
I'm a big free speech guy but this one is genuinely a bit complex.
[–] briandw 6 hours ago
[–] hnlmorg 5 hours ago
- [ ] Disable autocomplete swear filter.
But finely grained options are not Apple’s way.
[–] Retric 1 hour ago
Consider the logic for tap’s could offer hundreds of customizations. That’s core functionality and I’m sure someone internally is thinking deeply about many of them. But if you offer zero customization most people just get used to how things operate so skipping that functionality isn’t terrible for the average user. Instead they offer options for people with disabilities which is a distinct group who can’t just adapt and thus a meaningful justification.
[–] sam1714 5 hours ago
Disable swears, alcohol, smoking, marijuana, gambling, child abuse and neglect, sensitive East Asian politics, sensitive Middle Eastern politics, WWII politics, Late Ottoman genocides, LGB issues, T issues, global warming, nuclear power, HOA issues, vegetarian issues, vegan issues...
[–] buran77 5 hours ago
Talking about autocorrect and irritation, I remember a situation where someone caused a minor international incident by writing that something "caused a lot of irritation". The word they were aiming for before autocorrect chimed in was "iterations" (on a document). I'd rather make my own mistakes than constantly have to fight an autocorrect system.
[–] cite_please 5 hours ago
[–] roenxi 3 hours ago
It'd be a better if Apple provided a list somewhere for transparency but what they are doing isn't going to cause anyone any trouble.
[–] howunfortunate 1 hour ago
[–] Dylan16807 3 hours ago
[–] xenator 7 hours ago
[–] hairofadog 7 hours ago
[–] howunfortunate 7 hours ago
[–] throooooo 7 hours ago
[–] conception 6 hours ago
Or we could just type the whole sentence we need.
[–] reorder9695 6 hours ago
[–] SV_BubbleTime 3 hours ago
[–] stavros 5 hours ago
[–] alfjal 7 hours ago
[–] nostrademons 7 hours ago
[–] stackghost 6 hours ago
[–] rafram 7 hours ago
Tech-illiterate online mobs enraged by Apple “making a statement” will not stick around long enough to hear them argue about n-grams or whatever.
[–] bjourne 6 hours ago
Or imagine if it auto-completed "the Holocaust is" with "a myth created by the ZOG"! I don't like these "imagine if X was Y" arguments because X isn't Y. Refusing to auto-complete "the occupied territories" (X) is really not the same thing as refusing to auto-complete antisemitism or group-based hate speech (Y). Argue whether X is right or wrong without changing the subject.
[–] howunfortunate 5 hours ago
What you're really saying, perhaps without realizing it, is "I have zero empathy or theory of mind for people who have different views than me"
The whole reason these arguments exist is because power changes hands. If you like a rule only because the person currently wielding power aligns with you, you don't actually like the rule. You just like power.
[–] aucisson_masque 6 hours ago
Most people are not against transsexuals and gays.
There is no reason these kind of suggestions get pushed.
At least in the western civilization, I don’t see why it need to censor anything.
[–] sssilver 2 hours ago
In the Bay Area?
In the United States?
In the Middle East?
In India and China?
All of planet earth?
[–] scratcheee 9 hours ago
“Male chauvinist pig” is something many would be very upset to send to their boss by accident. So it’s perhaps understandable some such phrases are not excluded from the guesswork.
[–] ryandrake 8 hours ago
[–] kragen 7 hours ago
We might not talk about a "narrow contingency put" or "Maria crating PVC" very often, but an uncensored autocorrect would almost certainly correct those phrases to the far more common "male chauvinist pig" in the rare cases where someone did try to swipe them.
[–] Arnt 7 hours ago
Step 1: a word of 4-6 letters that's somewhat close to "male". Say "name" or "masked". Look at the key positions, you'll see what I mean.
Step 2: a word that's even less close to chauvinist, and that makes sense after the word you intended, but no sense after "male", so the guesser picks "chauvinist", based on its incorrect first guess and your second swipe.
Step 3: ditto.
[–] Nevermark 4 hours ago
The difference matters enough that preemptively suggesting "pig" is not a desirable "service" for most people.
[–] hnlmorg 5 hours ago
I know these are all typos because she’s a really close friend and easily the last person who would be offensive to other people.
So yes, you’d be surprised at what people can typo on a phone.
[–] cromka 2 hours ago
[–] pests 9 hours ago
[–] Arnt 8 hours ago
The regular key-by-key will also do some probabilistic changes. Just less than the swipe interpreter.
[–] hilbert42 5 hours ago
I'm against Apple's attempt to meld popular speech into a form that it thinks is acceptable on two accounts—I'm not the fastest typist so when prediction doesn't work the way I want it to it slows me down. Second, I'm in Australia and Australians use very colorful expressions in everday speech that seem to trigger the sensibilities of many delicate American ears. In short, we don't want attempts to censor what we say.
If one has to introduce censorship into prediction then users should have the option of either turning it off or selecting a graded system that best suits their style.
In fact that's not a completely new idea. Eudora email had an option that I rather liked, when selected, users could type whatever they liked then depending on the degree of offense or profanity a series of red chilli icons would appear. Mildly offensive text would bring up an icon with a one-chili warning whereas highly offensive language would automatically trigger a three-chili icon along with a message to the effect "They're burning hot words, do you really want to send this message as is?"
A scheme along these lines seems eminently more sensible than secretly censoring a predictive word list.
[–] simondotau 3 hours ago
[–] JTbane 2 hours ago
[–] conradev 9 hours ago
- There is a chance, quantified by some metric, where a person is suggested a word that is offensive to them or their culture because a probabilistic model made the wrong decision.
- There is no chance that the above happens.
Apple will choose the latter, time and time again, because they are risk averse and freedom is not particularly high on their values list. We’re talking about the company that doesn’t let you type the Taiwanese flag in China, or the pride flag in Russia. It’s no surprise you’re not allowed to swipe “fuck” in the United States. I used to work at Apple.
[–] Litost 9 hours ago
The ultimate problem being some subset of consumers want autocomplete and some subset will retain the right to be offended and some subset will be both of those?
EDIT: And at what point does accidently sending male chauvinist pig to your boss because of autocomplete absolve you of the responsibility of reading the message before you send it?
Is there any reason apple can't give us the choice of.
a) No autocomplete.
b) Autocomplete with greylist.
c) Autocomplete without greylist.
[–] hxtk 4 hours ago
If it didn’t auto complete then that would be fine when hitting keys individually, but when I’m swiping the words, it means no matter how accurate I am or how many attempts I make, it will literally never produce that word in that position.
And it’s contextual. Obviously I can swipe in “me,” but if it’s after the word “kill” then it’s banned, and I simply can’t dedicate the space in my head to learning this inscrutable list of banned phrases that until this article I’d been unable to find anywhere so I could only ever discover a phrase was on it by having an extremely frustrating time trying and failing to type it until I realized “oh, this is a politically or emotionally charged phrase (or could be in a different context) and I’m not that bad at typing so it’s probably banned.”
[–] Calazon 8 hours ago
[–] rpdillon 6 hours ago
[–] bawolff 5 hours ago
Because they are in the business of making money and the business case for this doesn't make sense.
[–] kragen 7 hours ago
There are cases like https://gizmodo.com/a-cellphones-missing-dot-kills-two-peopl... where, in 02008, Ramazan Çalçoban texted his estranged wife in Turkish, "you change the topic every time you run out of arguments", but the lack of the Turkish dotless "i" on his cellphone turned "sıkısınca" into "sikisinca", which looks more like a misspelling of "sikisince". So he ended up texting her, "You change the topic every time they are fucking you."
Long story short, his father-in-law murdered him for thus insulting his daughter's fidelity, following which he murdered the daughter in question, and the father-in-law committed suicide in prison.
So there might be certain words and phrases that it's best for your computers to not send to other people on your behalf unless they're really sure you mean them.
[–] rpdillon 6 hours ago
[–] kragen 6 hours ago
[–] philipallstar 7 hours ago
[–] kragen 7 hours ago
[–] bluegatty 3 hours ago
No, this is the wrong analogy.
Keyboard helpers are 'positive aid' vs 'no aid', not 'restriction' vs 'no restriction'.
It's akin to seeing the 'default' on search to 'not have adult conent' -> you can make the adjustment yourself.
Helping you type the 'n-word' is a positive act.
It's perfectly reasonable to have any words they even remotely deem sensitive not in the dictionary.
The first time you meaningfully type a word though - it should go in the dictionary like a normal word and that's that.
If they were stopping people from putting words in the dictionary or making it harder - now that would be censorship.
If they won't put 'whatever' in the auto-option feature that would be 'restrictive' and bad.
But otherwise, it's 100% reasonable for them to chose the words they want to help you type.
And FYI this is also different from censoring search which could not be undone.
[–] lynndotpy 8 hours ago
For anyone wondering the degree to which this is an exaggeration: The iPhone will physically work against you by invisibly changing the size of keys on the keyboard.
Every iPhone, since the very first, dynamically resizes the hitboxes of the iOS keyboard. This is invisible, can not be disabled, and the hitboxes overlap those of other keys.
They used to advertise this as "dynamic tap zones" but they removed the video for it, but you can see their advertising for it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPmVKyhyl9U
[–] kenferry 3 hours ago
[–] madeofpalk 2 hours ago
[–] kenferry 1 hour ago
I also feel like it could be better, but this thread seems a little over the top. Censorship because it avoids autocompleting things that might embarrass you?? And as was just posted a couple days ago, if you intentionally use words and phrases, it will learn that you do and will go ahead and suggest them https://helgesver.re/articles/macos-vulgar-word-flags .
[–] black_knight 7 hours ago
[–] degrees57 2 hours ago
Apparently, names that begin with Di outnumber names that begin with Du four-to-one.
[–] bawolff 5 hours ago
I think its pretty easy to imagine. Execs dont want to be dragged in the news when the phone auto suggests something politically controversial. Companies are very risk averse when it comes to that sort of thing.
I doubt this was even controversial enough to warrant a meeting.
[–] chabes 6 hours ago
[–] nostrademons 7 hours ago
The concern with features like these is that the suggestions are considered to be corporate speech that the company is endorsing, and so it can be held liable for any that break relevant laws. Internet companies are generally considered common carriers when they're just passing around stuff other people write, but when they are generating their own content through machine-learning algorithms they are held to be the actual responsible party.
I'm surprised we haven't seen more lawsuits and criminal prosecution against LLMs so far, though it probably helps that the current U.S. president is a combative asshole that prides himself on how much he can offend every group under the sun.
[–] dofm 6 hours ago
[–] giancarlostoro 8 hours ago
[–] unparagoned 8 hours ago
[–] ivanjermakov 8 hours ago
[–] II2II 7 hours ago
I realize that there are many reasons to be critical of our digital overlords. This is not one of them.
This is in no way comparable to a physical keyboard stopping you from typing something, because what you are typing is entirely deterministic. Most computer software will underline only misspelled words or grammatical errors, not politically charged statements, because it is a literal interpretation of what the user typed.
Swipe typing and auto-complete are different because they are interpreting the user's input. There is no way to ensure the interpretation is correct. For the sake of both the users and the company, you ensure the interpretations are the ones that cause no harm.
[–] stouset 5 hours ago
“I was talking about Winnie the Pooh, and my phone autocorrected Tigger into something much worse. We probably don’t want iPhones to autocorrect towards some words, even if they’re legitimate words. Do y’all think it makes sense to bias autocorrect away from potentially risky subjects?”
You can still type that word into your phone. You can still send it to anyone you wish. Autocorrect just isn’t going to suggest it to you on accident. Not autocorrecting to potentially embarrassing, uncomfortable, or sensitive subjects is probably a good idea that’s—at the iPhone scale—probably saved quite a few people’s jobs by not fat fingering something that would have gotten someone fired.
[–] noah_buddy 10 hours ago
Apple should not be in the business of editorializing their users’ writings. The whole deferral to “well you can just manually type it out” raises the obvious question “then why can’t I swipe it out?”
[–] creata 10 hours ago
Because then it could look like they're suggesting the word to you, rather than you explicitly selecting it, and they don't want to be accused of suggesting any terms that might be controversial, for the same reason they don't want to be accused of suggesting profanity to their users.
[–] evrydayhustling 9 hours ago
This is how censorship works best, if folks start anticipating and avoiding it so the censors dont even have to exert pressure.
[–] otterley 9 hours ago
HN is hardly immune from this; it’s no small irony that there will be people doing that very thing right here in these comments.
[–] schiffern 9 hours ago
They have a good argument, too! Why should Apple be able to hide behind the excuse that the data is crowdsourced, therefore they have no responsibility for it? Didn't the social networks try that one already?
Damned if you do and damned if you don't, in this situation.
[–] tavavex 8 hours ago
If Apple doesn't want its autocorrect to suggest statistically likely opinions on divisive topics, then sure, whatever. But when it has a hard blacklist of input it will categorically refuse from the user and editorialize it with nonsensical changes that only serve to avoid the blacklist, that is a very, very bad look.
[–] ryandrake 7 hours ago
If the user tried to swipe-type "Tibetan independence" and got one or two letters wrong, there's still probably a 90% or even 99% likelihood that their intent was to type "Tibetan independence." Not suggesting "Tibetan independence" is censorship, it's not benign carefulness.
We're not talking about Apple accidentally turning "Buttermilk pancakes" into "Muslim extremist."
[–] schiffern 5 hours ago
>and "we know what you wanted to type with 90% confidence
Sounds great.Problem is, because statistics, 90% confidence is wrong 10% of the time. Now you have a big polarizing news story about Apple pushing Trump (or Biden) propaganda onto some maximally sympathetic person who hates that sort of thing.
Damned if you do and damned if you don't, like I said!
Apple chose the sin of omission over the sin of commission. I think that's the right move. Of all the terrible options, Apple found the least terrible IMO.
[–] giantrobot 9 hours ago
Much hay was made in some circles that Google was saying George W. Bush's White House was a miserable failure. No tech company wants to be the target of that sort of campaign today. Especially not with a petulant thin skinned narcissist in office that already has demanded protection money to ward off tariffs and other retribution available to the Presidency.
[–] DonHopkins 10 hours ago
There were two buttons, one labeled "Our Web Site", the other labeled "Our Competitor's Web Site".
When you moved the mouse over the "Our Competitor's Web Site" button, it would quickly slide out from under your cursor before you could click it!
Then when you stopped moving your mouse, the "Our Web Site" button would slyly slide right underneath your mouse!
Dammit Microsoft!!! ;)
[–] ozim 9 hours ago
See I tapped out all those characters just for you.
[–] isodev 8 hours ago
[–] ryandrake 7 hours ago
[–] QuadmasterXLII 9 hours ago
Come to think of it, intuitively any attempt to solve this by tuning the LLM would make texters sound subtly like claude- in which case absolutely the blacklist is better.
[–] tavavex 9 hours ago
[–] metadat 8 hours ago
[–] QuadmasterXLII 9 hours ago
[–] willis936 5 hours ago
[–] JoshTriplett 6 hours ago
"When testing autocomplete, we found some cases where it produces undesirable completions. Imagine if someone typed 'nazis are' and the autocomplete suggested 'good'. How fast would that screenshot get around social media with a tweet comparing iPhone to Grok, and turn into a news headline?"
I'm guessing that that's how this started. Then, a few steps later, "we're getting into China, what do we need to do to not get in trouble", "hey, we've got this mechanism, what if we add 'Tibetan independence' to it". (Which is bad, but on the same scale as all the other things businesses do to get into what they see as a large market that they can be blocked from at any time.)
Then, a few steps later, after some seriously questionable decision-making, someone had the bright idea to add "iMessage isn't working" to it. Frankly, that's the one I'm actually most baffled by here, because everything else seems like the natural consequence of a combination of bad-PR-avoidance and geopolitical kowtowing.
[–] skybrian 9 hours ago
It seems like a way to make it sound more dramatic if you dislike it.
[–] tavavex 8 hours ago
You have door 1 and 2 presented to you by me. You're equally likely to want to pick both options. Door 1 is open. Door 2 is locked, but you can ask me to come over and undo all the locks to open it for you.
Run the test over a large number of people, and then shockingly, it turns out that doing this made more people choose door 1, even though they didn't have a preference beforehand. According to your logic, I did not coerce anyone by designing the choice in this obtuse way because after all you can still choose between the two options. But more people ended up choosing the option I wanted them to pick, weird.
If this coercion didn't work, companies wouldn't be hard at work designing revolutionary new types of dark patterns that make you more likely to accept the cookies, back out of deleting your account or decline enabling an option in the settings they don't want you to use anymore.
[–] skybrian 3 hours ago
[–] russelldjimmy 9 hours ago
Keyboard swiping involves some prediction work from the system. It is ultimately making a best guess from the keys your finger has passed through. The only truly “accurate” output would be for the keyboard to spell out the gibberish that arises from showing every key that the finger has swiped over. Anything intelligible is a guess.
Now because it is a guess, some may question the system or its makers, “Why did you guess this, and not that?” It is easy to see how this can make the maker of the system the target of a politically motivated group. For example, there is a difference between typing out “Dictator Trump” and my keyboard refusing to spell it out - a clear sign of censorship. However, when swiped, because of the guessing nature of the technology, I can understand that the maker of the system (Apple in this case) would not want to be seen endorsing these views. Hence, they do not offer up these politically charged phrases. We are free to type them out, because it is easy to point out that the intent is entirely from the user. However, it is harder to argue for this from the swiping keys gesture.
In my view, this is a more reasonable explanation.
[–] tavavex 9 hours ago
I fully reject that this makes the situation any better or more justifiable. The job of the software that picks what you have likely just said, swiped or tapped should only concern the given word. If the algorithm decides with 95% certainty that the input was "dictator", that's what it should output. If context is used to better select the candidate word, it should only be done for the purpose of slightly re-weighting the possible options with one transparent algorithm, not for checks against a blacklist.
The reason why I think this is that your line of thinking is unbounded, and there is nothing stopping the next logical move - if Apple can decide 'not to endorse' (representation isn't endorsement, but whatever) views by blacklisting its algorithms from forming certain phrases, why can't they uplink entire paragraphs of your text as you're typing it to dynamically analyze them instead of using a dumb filter, and then decide if the entire text is something they want to allow?
[–] ryandrake 9 hours ago
[–] Detrytus 9 hours ago
That's the whole point: swiping is a very imprecise method, and the user intent is not clear at all, so Apple avoids making "controversial" guesses.
[–] ryandrake 9 hours ago
[–] recursive 9 hours ago
[–] JumpCrisscross 9 hours ago
Which is another way of saying identically ambiguous.
Resolving for a safer option when given a choice isn’t censorship in my view. I can, at the end of the day, type out fuck.
[–] uptrails 9 hours ago
[–] wiseowise 6 hours ago
Don't attribute to malice what can be attributed to stupidity. Most likely it is implemented in such a way to produce the least amount of outrage.
[–] slashdave 6 hours ago
Most likely from user testing.
[–] gxs 8 hours ago
Unfortunately the broader more important point of censorship is drowned out in noise as designed
Same with how congress names their bills. Wow you’re not voting for the Save The Children from Internet Monsters act? What’s wrong with you?
Oh you mean the bill that grants the government cart blanche to go through anyone’s email without a warrant?
We’re in a tough spot here - there’s just nothing to pattern match to - not cleanly at least
The way a few tech companies can steer trends and conversations is unprecedented. The data collection is unprecedented
Specifically the scale is. People truly don’t understand the scale these companies operate at
No newspaper or wire tapping ever had the reach this stuff has now
[–] ChadNauseam 7 hours ago
[–] gxs 6 hours ago
A complete slang language? A world where people don’t have a vocabulary to describe the difference between themselves? A utopia where no one sees race because you can’t type white people?
Probably a society that’s just primed to do what corporations want
Yes yes tinfoil hat and all that
[–] spacebanana7 5 hours ago
On TikTok for example, OF creators have become ever more indirect in communicating what they do - porn became corn which became the corn emoji, then that degenerated into any mix of base ingredient emojis.
On race, people use dog breeds to substitute for skin colour. In general, golden retrievers are used as a euphemism for white people and pit bulls for black people. The context of a video often seems plausible in a dog context - for example someone might say that pit bulls are 13% of dogs but 50% of dog attacks (actually referring to the African American murder rate per capita[1]) (pit bulls are over represented in most dog injury stats but there’s no reliable figure for 13/50).
The overall effect has been to make the comprehension of the platform less.
[1] I don’t mean to state this is correct either but it’s the figure these content creators are trying to express, see the ADL article on 1350 or the danish race crime stats for critique/validation
[–] dizhn 9 hours ago
[–] tpmoney 8 hours ago
I imagine it went the same way that board meetings about any potential PR disaster go. "How bad of a reputational hit will we take if the NYT runs a headline about some kid getting auto suggested something culturally taboo on their iPad? Would it be more than the reputational hit we will take from the people that are annoyed that we won't auto suggest 'Nazi' to complete the phrase 'Trump is a' while they're typing out their tweets? If so, then let's add the list of "do not suggest" to our auto complete system." And that doesn't begin to count the bad press they could get if someone intentionally tries to get the auto complete system to generate something offensive. See also the AI companies getting shit because people were able to get the image generators to generate porn.
Such is the nature of trying to sell your products in a world where most people treat every single thing done by their technology as an intentional act chosen by the developers to specifically target them. If you want to buy someone else's package, you have to live with the fact that they are going to respond to the incentives to avoid headline scandals and government scrutiny much more strongly than to cater to a idealistic free speech model. This is why having a strong social and cultural free speech norm, that extends far beyond the legal letter of the law is so important. You want society as a whole to broadly consider free speech important and worth having over the inconvenience of Tiny Tim learning a new word today.
[–] rdtsc 6 hours ago
Looking at https://helgesver.re/articles/macos-vulgar-word-flags for the list.
I imagined it something like this:
"Mao?" -"Bad, we think? But we want to allow 'LMAO'"
"Next. Stalin?" -"Hmm... Uncle Joe. Only a few million killed. Not great, not terrible, let's keep him"
"Pol Pot?" -"How many died in the Killing Fields?" "Not enough, keep him off the list".[–] ozim 9 hours ago
I don’t want to make a mistake calling someone cunt.
Even more so I DON’T want software type out cunt or fuck on its own to a person I totally don’t want to write fucking swear words.
Typed on an iPhone.
[–] doginasuit 5 hours ago
[–] Someone1234 11 hours ago
Considering arguably the keyboard itself is one of the most common "touch surfaces" on iOS, the level of neglect and level of overall quality is staggering. There's some serious incentive problems at Apple if nobody is tasked with making one of the best digital keyboards in the world.
PS - Whoever came up with the concept, on swipe-style touch keyboards, of the "Tap Map"/Heatmap wherein keys visible location doesn't match their touch area - so that BY DESIGN it always provides an inconsistent user experience needs to be fired into the sun. You literally cannot disable it on most mobile keyboards. It is on iOS's native keyboard AND Microsoft's Swiftkey.
[–] noitpmeder 11 hours ago
[–] Someone1234 11 hours ago
The fact Apple aren't embarrassed by the iOS keyboard is very surprising and disappointing.
[–] Henchman21 10 hours ago
[–] intrasight 2 hours ago
[–] ftchd 8 hours ago
Apple is free to make their product work however they want. They're not creating laws or public utilities.
[–] sli 7 hours ago
[–] dmix 7 hours ago
That's different than youtube demonetizing or suspending you because you said some word in a video.
[–] preg_match 6 hours ago
Apple, evidently, does not want you to say these things. They can’t outright ban phrases due to optics, so they do this instead.
[–] kayodelycaon 3 hours ago
The middle ground here is to not suggest anything at all. Because they’re either pushing people to say something or preventing them from saying something.
The HN crowd forgets that average people don’t know how technology works. Everyone I know would see this as a good feature.
[–] bbarn 5 hours ago
[–] Melatonic 2 hours ago
[–] al_borland 6 hours ago
I used to tell people just type and trust it to work, it was great. Now, even when I type the right thing, the auto-complete will screw it up after the fact. I feel like I need to proofread everything. I wish we could go back to whatever setup they had 19 years ago.
[–] AnotherGoodName 6 hours ago
- Sent from my iPhone.
[–] talon8635 6 hours ago
[–] scosman 10 hours ago
[–] user_7832 9 hours ago
Swipe "Ireland" alone, works. "United" alone, works.
Same swipes but back to back, and now it's suddenly "United Iceland".
There's no predictive text involved here, this starts going into the willful territory.
[–] pj1115 6 hours ago
Picked at random: "right wing propaganda" isn't severe enough a phrase that I instinctively know I'm hitting a swear filter. After swiping the last word iOS goes back and changes the second word to "Wong". In order to understand what was happening and then fix it, I had to backspace (deleting the whole phrase), re-swipe both words, backspace, re-swipe both words again, double tap the incorrect word, backspace, type the word, tap to return to the end of the sentence, and hit space. All to fix one letter.
If this was really about protecting people from accidentally typing these that might land them in hot water, why wouldn't iOS at least offer the word it knew I wanted in the suggestion bar?
[–] unpleasurable 2 hours ago
[–] flumpcakes 8 hours ago
[–] wiseowise 6 hours ago
[–] scosman 6 hours ago
You didn't "swipe Ireland", you're swiping something like IUYTRERGHJKLKJHGFDSASDCVBNHGFD" and it's predicting "Ireland".
[–] pj1115 6 hours ago
I tried typing "propaganda" ten times with 100% accuracy. When it's preceded with "[left] wing", the accuracy drops to 0%.
[–] scosman 6 hours ago
Try swiping "grocery lost" and it will predict "grocery list", even you swiped over "o" and not "i". "put", "pit" and "pot" are all exactly the same swipe, and it always has to guess which you want.
It really is always guessing, and never completely sure. Every good consumer predictive system has some guardrails. Not guessing "free tibet" for someone in China could keep them out of serious trouble.
Could then tune the confidence thresholds instead of block list? Probably. Are they censoring you? No, just tap the letters.
[–] aucisson_masque 6 hours ago
I swipe Ireland, it gets it right the first time.
I swipe “united ireland” a hundred times, it never work.
It’s not probability.
[–] ryandrake 9 hours ago
[–] Rexxar 10 hours ago
[–] ksec 4 hours ago
Auto Complete on Swipe Input and Next Word Predictive Input.
This is not an Autocorrect spelling issue.
[–] Jtarii 10 hours ago
[–] morkalork 9 hours ago
[–] akersten 10 hours ago
Alright, well some of us are actually deft at swiping text on our phones and would very much like the keyboard to type the word we entered.
[–] scosman 10 hours ago
[–] noitpmeder 10 hours ago
The models know which words we intend to type. The problem is those specific words are on unchangeable and hidden block lists.
[–] dizhn 9 hours ago
[–] hocusPokeUs 10 hours ago
Yea it's not the best option in all situations but fixing voice dictation glitches is way less tapping over the long haul; fingers no go numb using it as much as possible by saving the tap tap tap for absolutely necessary moments
[–] angry_octet 8 hours ago
[–] moron4hire 8 hours ago
[–] vlyan 9 hours ago
for now :)
[–] mitthrowaway2 10 hours ago
... Actually I'm not sure if they let you do those.
[–] aranelsurion 8 hours ago
My Apple Watch has a setting for how long the display stays on before sleep. It’s a dropdown with two choices: 15 seconds or 70 seconds. Would you prefer 30 seconds? Why not 60 seconds instead of 70 you say? Fuck you, you don’t know better than Apple designers. Take it or leave it, best we can do is 15 seconds.
[–] sandworm101 10 hours ago
[–] Rodmine 6 hours ago
[–] allarm 10 hours ago
[–] exmadscientist 9 hours ago
I'd have tried to work out more detailed behavior but I'm poor enough at swiping (at least with Gboard) that there's little point in trying to pin it down that well, at least for me.
[–] umvi 8 hours ago
[–] exmadscientist 7 hours ago
[–] ram1500natrluvr 8 hours ago
[–] rationalist 4 hours ago
[–] globular-toast 6 hours ago
[–] jerlam 11 hours ago
[–] user_7832 9 hours ago
[–] altern8 9 hours ago
[–] duskwuff 9 hours ago
[–] ethin 4 hours ago
[–] 1d22a 4 hours ago
I'm sympathetic to the idea that something as basic as a keyboard should have no say in what you type, but the only solution might be to turn off predictive text.
[–] willis936 2 hours ago
[–] OJFord 4 hours ago
[–] tartoran 1 hour ago
I had no idea it was on purpose but I exper
[–] kazinator 7 hours ago
[–] crazygringo 10 hours ago
This seems like a feature, because I swipe all the time and send messages without realizing I got a word wrong, especially because the word it chooses is usually with the same first letter and approximately same length.
All this is doing is avoiding high-risk words and terms, and making you type them out letter by letter to ensure you aren't sending an accidentally sexual/swear/political message to your Mom/boss/colleague.
This would be problematic and censorship if it were preventing you from typing the phrases at all. It's clearly a helpful feature, however, to prevent you from accidentally typing risky phrases when using something as error-prone as swipe typing.
[–] -_- 7 hours ago
Some blocked phrases are quite arbitrary: Australia, India, Kenya, Nepal, Pakistan, and the US are the only countries you can't say are bad or poor. Trayvon Martin is the only full name you can't write. You can call Putin, Biden, or Xi a dictator, but not Trump. In other languages, the suppression can be even worse.
And some are ridiculously overbroad: "is important" and "black woman" are blocked! When I try to swipe them, I get "is impotent" and "blank woman".
I think it's not totally unreasonable for a list like this to exist, at least for autocomplete, but it ought to be transparent so people can see the impact Apple's choices are having on our use of language. Individually it's a small nudge, but on the scale of billions of iPhones it can shape the discourse.
[–] jefftk 3 hours ago
[–] twodave 4 hours ago
[–] nsoam 11 hours ago
[–] IAmGraydon 8 hours ago
Or the list itself:
[–] inventor7777 1 hour ago
This kind of thing is also why Spotify has their own smart shuffle, because the normal shuffle didn't care what came next. The shuffle was working properly by simply shuffling it, but since it didn't SEEM like it, an algorithm had to be made.
[–] shlewis 2 hours ago
[–] dualvariable 7 hours ago
[–] rootusrootus 7 hours ago
[–] dzink 7 hours ago
[–] qmr 5 hours ago
[–] user_7832 12 hours ago
[–] andsoitis 11 hours ago
[–] newsy888 10 hours ago
[–] vjvjvjvjghv 10 hours ago
[–] rootusrootus 7 hours ago
[–] pesus 8 hours ago
I'm leaving the above 'typo' in as an example of it. I initially typed "people I", and it showed up as "people I" at first, but after typing more it subtly and retroactively changed it to "people's". That's not something that should happen in general. It doesn't make sense grammatically or contextually, and S isn't anywhere near I on the keyboard.
That's not counting at least one other instance in this not-so-long comment where it did the same with "should" -> "show", but I fixed that one. I'm baffled no one at Apple seemed to notice and/or care that they actively made the keyboard worse.
[–] hurfdurf 7 hours ago
[–] amelius 9 hours ago
[–] npteljes 6 hours ago
[–] Pesthuf 7 hours ago
[–] brcmthrowaway 7 hours ago
[–] assimpleaspossi 7 hours ago
A distant relative married into a family outside of our normal circle. When he brought along a someone from that side to a Thanksgiving family dinner, her language was loaded with the well known bombs where, at one point, someone brought her into another room for a talking to.
As it should be done.
[–] remuskaos 6 hours ago
[–] assimpleaspossi 3 hours ago
[–] dub4u 6 hours ago
[–] assimpleaspossi 3 hours ago
Speaking of Ireland, I was there last year and never heard a foul word spoken. Then there was the time we walked down one street and turned the corner to see a few young men at the far end. Moments later I heard a crash and turned to see a heavy whiskey bottle lane near us as the men ran away. If you consider me a "showcase" then I wonder which group you would have been with. Mine or those young men.
[–] egorfine 8 hours ago
[–] ryankrage77 8 hours ago
[–] crossroadsguy 2 hours ago
To be honest, this is a mild minor issue when it comes to iOS stock keyboard.
In short: I'd have not even touched iOS's stock keyboard app (from the day Apple allowed such apps) had Apple added a simple feature of letting users disallow internet access to specific apps.
[–] mckn1ght 10 hours ago
Well I just swyped it into this comment, and double checked in iMessage, although hilariously, it types “isn’t” correctly, but then when I type “real” it “corrects” it by removing the apostrophe.
and all I wanted to do was make a bad joke about how I’m thankful Apple won’t let me ruin my five-year-old’s dreams by sending her an accidental soul crushing text.
On a real note, though, if they could just find a way to fix the issue where every time I type an “i” to say “I“ it instead types an “o” all by itself like I’m some kind of 17th century bard, and then anytime I want to type “a“ as an indefinite article, it will type a single “s” by itself, which almost never makes any grammatical sense in the English language unless you’re talking about the letter “s” itself.
[–] mzajc 11 hours ago
I suppose ditching Apple is "two birds with one stone" :)
[–] cvwright 11 hours ago
The others are blatant censorship.
[–] emptybits 4 hours ago
Pressing send after a swiped/typed/predicted sequence of words is still entirely up to YOU.
[–] lukeschlather 9 hours ago
It will be interesting as corporate predictive text generators take over the world and companies like Apple will literally build the Jobsian reality distortion field into their products to portray their services as working better than they are.
[–] loloquwowndueo 8 hours ago
[–] drevil-v2 8 hours ago
[–] kayodelycaon 3 hours ago
God isn’t universal either. You push a specific religion and cultural view on people by assuming every instance of God should be capitalized.
[–] mauvehaus 8 hours ago
[–] stephbook 8 hours ago
[–] bryanrasmussen 9 hours ago
I suppose it must be region bound, with different phrases per region?
on edit: when I said illegal I of course mean liable for fines or open to civil suits.
[–] supriyo-biswas 11 hours ago
[1] https://www.wired.com/story/google-autocomplete-vile-suggest...
[–] noah_buddy 10 hours ago
[–] bigstrat2003 9 hours ago
[–] allarm 10 hours ago
[–] wat10000 3 hours ago
[–] mschuster91 9 hours ago
Which the iPhone conveniently also does [1].
The problem is, media loves something to feed outrage, and Evangelical pressure groups love to raise a stink over bullshit any journalist with an ounce of self respect would discard.
[1] https://9to5mac.com/2025/07/02/facetime-in-ios-26-will-freez...
[–] ezfe 9 hours ago
[–] allarm 8 hours ago
[–] ezfe 4 hours ago
[–] rootusrootus 7 hours ago
I could understand if they just wanted to make sure no accidental swipes resulted in shit, piss, fuck, cunt, cocksucker, motherfucker, or tits. That is defensible (though I'd want a toggle to turn it off and accept the risk). But they go so much farther, into phrases that some genius there decided I should be offended to type. That's too much.
[–] open-listings 8 hours ago
[–] oddIdentities 6 hours ago
[–] fantasizr 10 hours ago
[–] no-trbl-2-u 6 hours ago
[–] mattmaroon 2 hours ago
[–] wat10000 3 hours ago
Autocomplete is fraught with peril. Maybe I'm actually trying to type "duck." Maybe I'm talking about my "new oven" and I'd really like it not to think I meant to press J instead of N. (True story.)
Autocomplete is a low reward, high risk endeavor. If you get it right, you've helped the user slightly. If you get it wrong, you may get the user in serious trouble and they'll be telling everyone about how "my iPhone got me fired." But you have to have it, so they'll try to reduce the odds of a bad outcome by refusing to produce various phrases that could be problematic.
[–] drdexebtjl 11 hours ago
Swipeblocked: The phrases your iPhone won't suggest
[–] msephton 6 hours ago
Anyway, I use EFkey keyboard (I’m a customer, not developer) which has none of this nonsense.
[–] noitpmeder 11 hours ago
This is an _insane_ lever for censorship. Does Israel pay them to omit “the occupied territories”? Is that internal Apple policy irrespective of nation state pressure?
It's not just madness that these exist, but that they are hidden, unexposed to the user, and have no justification or rationale.
[–] nsoam 11 hours ago
I wonder where that summary came from?
[–] eesmith 8 hours ago
Otherwise there would not be things like "List of unsolved murders (2000–present)". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsolved_murders_(2000...
[–] rootusrootus 5 hours ago
The unsolved murders list is probably the same deal, it is colloquial and not legal, and with nobody accused and put to trial, it may yet end up legally murder.
[–] bawolff 5 hours ago
There is not a huge difference between "the victim was not found to have been murdered." and "the jury did not find the evidence persuasive enough to decide guilt for the charged person for the charged crime". If you want to get really nitpicky, just because "the victim was not found to have been murdered", doesn't mean that they weren't murdered. Whether they were found to be murdered is a different statement than if they were actually murdered.
[–] bdhe 10 hours ago
I'm flagging that this doesn't sound like a good faith discussion. The green account raises my priors.
Note that I'm not suggesting that Apple's policy on censorship is good, quite the contrary.
[–] bawolff 5 hours ago
Wikipedia writes in the second paragraph "...but a jury acquitted him of second-degree murder and manslaughter in July 2013"
How is that framed differently than Wikipedia did?
Or do you mean the part after "i.e.", but i.e. is literally latin for "in other words". So obviously the part after i.e. was reframed, that is what i.e. means.
[–] bdhe 5 hours ago
[–] nsoam 4 hours ago
The Wikipedia entry states that a jury found that the person who killed him did not murder him. If what was done to him was not murder, then he was not murdered.
Therefore the iOS summary is wrong.
[–] bawolff 3 hours ago
Its a reasonable view for someone to think that if a court finds a "not guilty" verdict, and there is no dispute over who the killer is, especially if one of the defenses raised is self defense or lack of intent, then the term murdered is inappropriate. It is also reasonable for someone to disagree with that position. I don't have a dog in that fight, i just object to accusing without further basis, anyone who disagrees as being in bad faith.
[–] bbg2401 11 hours ago
[–] noitpmeder 11 hours ago
[–] jerf 11 hours ago
That is a general answer to your question. It is not a specific defense of the particular word list in question. But I can say I've been surprised a few times about what I accidentally swiped on Android. Bitch isn't swipable but I have "bitchiest" readily available, for instance.
[–] Jtarii 10 hours ago
This is just the type of thing that makes everyone hate modern technology.
[–] wat10000 3 hours ago
[–] noitpmeder 11 hours ago
[–] sigmar 11 hours ago
Inaccurate. According to swipeblocked.com it is blocked with both swiping and autocomplete.
[–] akersten 11 hours ago
[–] deadbabe 8 hours ago
It’s mostly automated, controversial phrases or topics are detected by analyzing various data sources and getting sentiment analysis from interactions that people have in response. Anything that causes overwhelming polarization or negative reactions or meets other criteria gets blocked. There is no agenda.
[–] Invictus0 43 minutes ago
[–] krater23 11 hours ago
[–] wiseowise 6 hours ago
[–] m3kw9 9 hours ago
[–] bouncycastle 5 hours ago
* damn autocorrect, that was meant to be "against the billionaires"
[–] xutopia 11 hours ago
[–] laweijfmvo 9 hours ago
[–] ezfe 9 hours ago
[–] ChrisArchitect 10 hours ago
Apple's predictive text restrictions include 'Dictator Trump' and 'Sleepy Joe'
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50391486
I dumped Apple's word list
[–] waltbosz 9 hours ago
"Glitch" more like "Easter egg" I suspect.
There was an emoji search/copy-paste web site that I use when I need to find an emoji. Once upon a time, when you typed "Trump" into the search, one of the results was the poop emoji. It no longer returns that, but it does return the Russian flag.
[–] tehjoker 8 hours ago
It would be nice certain companies could be chartered by the U.N. I think it would be much more difficult for them to do evil stuff if the majority of states had to agree on their charter. Not that there isn't a subset of things that all states want that sucks ass, but it's much less.
To the shocking number of people here who are justifying this or explaining how it only affect swipe input as if that makes it better: soft coercion is still coercion. If I made a physical keyboard that stops keys from working when you're about to finish typing something I don't want you to type, but you can still circumvent it, I still made a censorship keyboard. It's a sign of the times with how used tech companies are to 'softly' moderating societal trends by unilaterally tweaking the software that everyone uses.