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points by tyoma 1 day ago | 0 comments
Kids really love these things and get very excited to see them on the road.

They are going to be very valued collectors items in 30 years once the kids of today have enough disposable income to buy whichever are left roadworthy by then.

[–] coloneltcb 1 day ago
My experience is the opposite. My kids, and any friends of theirs riding with us, will boo whenever they see them on the road
[–] ivanjermakov 1 day ago
Emotions from both ends of a spectrum are positive indicators of future's collection value.
[–] Grombobulous 1 day ago
Unless you’re Ferrari or Porsche, you don’t want to be in the situation where your vehicle has future collectors’ value. That usually just means it didn’t sell very well (rarity).

Let’s keep in mind that Tesla invested in this truck to be the next F-150, which is the best-selling vehicle in the USA for the past multiple decades.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago
You’re talking about different things. A failure from a manufacturer perspective can be a major success from a collector perspective (see also the DeLorean).

Even the hated Edsel is worth quite a bit today.

Of course it might be harder to keep a Cybertruck running for 50 years due to all the computerized components. Restorers will probably be relegated to rebuilding Cybertruck bodies with new components.

[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago
> Of course it might be harder to keep a Cybertruck running for 50 years due to all the computerized components. Restorers will probably be relegated to rebuilding Cybertruck bodies with new components.

Really no different than any classic car, really. GM isn't selling OEM parts for a '57 Chevy, for example. If you need replacement parts on those, nowadays, you're likely going to specialty manufacturers given there really aren't any "parts cars" around anymore.

[–] olelele 20 hours ago
For combustion engine parts all you need is metal work tools, not locked down proprietary software and electronics. My dad has a 1954 Citroen b11 that he’s kept alive and humming since he got it in the late 60s.
[–] iamnothere 1 day ago
True, I just imagine that it will be harder for non-OEMs to make replacement electronics given how locked down Teslas are.
[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago
We'll have to wait and see. I honestly kind of doubt that will be true. There's all kinds of Tesla hacking that's been going on for years. It's possible to get a Tesla motor running without any external Tesla electronics through aftermarket solutions that carry support from the vendors.
[–] Grombobulous 1 day ago
I am talking about how value to collectors is irrelevant for most automakers.

Tesla’s corporate leadership would be much happier if the Cybertruck was selling 100,000 units a year and was not at all a collector’s item.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago
That’s not relevant to what the person you were responding to was talking about. They were talking about collectors.
[–] Grombobulous 1 day ago
And I’m talking about how their discussion of collectors is no consolation to the people at Tesla who were trying to make a mass-market profitable and successful vehicle.

I don’t have to talk about exactly what my comment parent is talking about in all facets. This isn’t a courtroom cross-examination.

[–] KerrAvon 1 day ago
In its time, the Edsel was more meh than hated. Mainly people didn't buy them because they were essentially pricier Fords and it was a recession year, and Ford threw in the towel for Ford-internal political reasons. The looks were not as much of an issue as people think today. It certainly didn't have the same political associations.

Good book on the subject: https://www.sup.org/books/history/disaster-dearborn

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago
Thanks for the clarification. My understanding was that the quality issues and exaggerated features drew a lot of mockery at the time. That’s not always enough to prevent something from succeeding (other polarizing vehicles like the Nissan Cube did OK) so the recession/internal politics angle makes sense.
[–] baggachipz 1 day ago
> Of course it might be harder to keep a Cybertruck running for 50 years due to all the computerized components

And all the well-documented reliability and quality issues.

[–] Grombobulous 17 hours ago
Considering the recent headlines about the decompilation and reverse engineering scenes, I doubt it!

If anything, the centralized control units of modern cars may make this sort of thing easier. A 2000’s car has more distributed pieces of vehicle control units (more similar to microcontrollers) while a modern EV built in the style of a Tesla has fewer compute components.

So in 50 years you’ll have some kind of recompilation scene where those computers get replaced, almost like how people replace their router software with OpenWRT or the people at vintage computer festivals who stand up reverse engineered AOL Instant Messenger services.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago
That’s not such a big issue for restorers, there were also extreme quality problems with the Edsel.
[–] sejje 1 day ago
1990s F150s are selling for much more than their original new price, with low enough miles.

Best selling truck of all time. Not really about rarity.

[–] maxlin 1 day ago
Clearly this behavior is not original, but taught. Kids don't "boo" things out of nowhere. They are indifferent as hell to things on their own sure, but not a CB ...
[–] PorciiVorbesc 1 day ago
>Kids don't "boo" things out of nowhere

Not all HNers are good parents

[–] next_xibalba 1 day ago
Very clearly behavior introduced and encouraged by the parents, driven by politics, and not the merits of the object itself. Though it is an interesting commentary on the extreme, enforced conformity and politicization-of-everything we see in the world today.
[–] maxlin 1 day ago
Absolutely. I am sad for these kids and their families. This is not how you raise curious, open-minded children.
[–] NewJazz 1 day ago
What evidence do you see that "everything" is politicized? Elon was the largest single donor in the US midterm elections by far... Seems like he politicized things himself.
[–] plagiarist 1 day ago
If the Nazi salute wasn't political enough. Children going through WWII in their history classes might dislike Cybertrucks independently of their parents.

It's always an excuse and everyone else's fault that things are politicized. The same people telling us to leave every social problem to the Invisible Hand get fussy when it actually manifests.

[–] deepsquirrelnet 1 day ago
> The same people telling us to leave every social problem to the Invisible Hand get fussy when it actually manifests.

Yep. This is the world the Supreme Court handed us with Citizen's United. Now that money is speech, we all have to accept that when we buy things, our money can be used against us.

This is the world they wanted, and if you hate cancel culture, then you need to get on board with fixing the damage from Citizen's United... not raging against regular people who are doing exactly what they are supposed to do, and using their money as speech.

What you buy is your politics now. It fucking sucks, but look at it with clearer eyes.

[–] ryeguy_24 1 day ago
Totally, what kid would boo something without being preconditioned to hate it? Humans can never separate concepts in there heads. Either you’re good or you’re evil. Have news for you all, we are all both. Not saying I support that guys behavior, but he’s done some impressive stuff to further mankind.
[–] RunSet 1 day ago
Quite something how many posts here seem to default to "Those children who do not share my opinion, they must have been brainwashed. It's the only explanation."
[–] ryeguy_24 18 hours ago
I mean, fair point. But it sure does smell like the original commenter's kids have been brainwashed. "Booing" a car or having a hateful attitude towards a car without any external influence? I actually don't think the Cybertruck looks good - at all. But all my kids are amazed by it. And we haven't spoken to them at all about Elon.
[–] komali2 1 day ago
> and not the merits of the object itself

This is interesting to say given that by most objective measures of what constitutes a good truck, the cybertruck is a bad truck.

Edit: the stupid bed cover gets stuck when exposed to a not abnormal amount of dirt. In dry climates the thing shocks you every time you touch it. People regularly are slicing their hands open randomly on it. Body panels routinely fall off. Accelerator pedal getting stuck triggering recall. Shape of the bed making it impossible to actually carry anything normal and rectangular, 100 mile tow range when putting actual weight on it, bad visibility. I've seen some hilarious videos of them getting stuck in road conditions my Yaris could handle. I've even seen someone catastrophically damage the wheels by turning them left and right rapidly a few times.

A good truck can carry things in the bed and tow something a long way. It can drive on and off a dirty worksite without critical components failing or getting dug in or snapping an axle. Or ok fine, the Houston family truck special, it should at least be able to take the cooler and kids to the beach without getting stuck.

The cybertruck is not a good truck. It may be a good something else, status symbol or something, maybe it's comfortable to drive, I don't particularly care, it's simply not a good truck.

[–] next_xibalba 1 day ago
> objective measures of what constitutes a good truck

There is literally no such thing. But regardless, in this subthread, we are discussing the response of children to the pure aesthetics of the truck (or lack thereof) vs. the coached, politicized reaction to what it is claimed to represent.

[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago
There are plenty of objective measures of what makes a good truck. Payload capacity. Towing capacity. Towing range. Stopping distance when at GVWR. Stopping distance when towing at or Max Towing Capacity. Does standard lumber fit in the bed with or without the tailgate open. If it requires the tailgate to be open, does it provide factory installed tiedowns to be able to safely carry cargo with the tailgate open.

There are, of course, plenty of subjective measures such as NVH, amenability to modification through the aftermarket, total cost of ownership, offroad capabilities, etc.

From everything I've seen, some of which OP mentioned in an edit, points to the Cybertruck being a terrible truck seemingly designed by folks who have never owned/used a truck. And again, that is ignoring Elon's politics.

[–] sejje 1 day ago
No there's not.

> Payload capacity.

Fighting against truck size, MPGs

> Towing capacity.

Fighting MPGs, possibly diesel prices

> Towing range.

Only matters on electrics, everyone else goes to the gas station.

> Stopping distance when at GVWR.

I don't max my truck out, and I don't really think others should, either.

Anyway, maybe you can see that objectively, I'd rather have a Nissan Hardbody than whatever Superduty Diesel you have in mind.

[–] slowin 1 day ago
Or, it's just objectively ugly and cringe, which it is.
[–] alt227 1 day ago
Nothing about design or looks is objective. Lots of people like the design. Dont assume your opinion is objectively 'right'.
[–] slowin 1 day ago
No, it objectively failed. That's why they are not going to make it anymore. "Lots of people" do not like it.
[–] plagiarist 1 day ago
N64 graphics vehicle.
[–] pfannkuchen 1 day ago
Sure but kids don’t generally boo at ugly cars, they just don’t really notice them.
[–] slowin 1 day ago
I think the cybertruck is orders of magnitude uglier than any other vehicle, so I think it's an expected response.
[–] dilap 1 day ago
Old enough to be haters, I guess.

Mostly I've seen younger kids love it. I was at the park and a little girl saw a Cybertruck pull up -- "Look, Dad, it's from the future!"

I think Cybertruck is probably ultimately a failure, but the amount of hate it gets when they are at least trying to push things outside of the normal makes me sad. The amount of negativity towards anything new that's not perfect is insane.

[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago
Look, there is "trying to push things outside of the normal" and then there is "completely misunderstanding the purpose of a half-ton truck." I say this despite that fact that the Cybertruck, from a size perspective, it straddles the line between half-ton and 3/4-ton, and it is a complete utter non-starter as a 3/4 ton for several reasons.

If the CyberTruck were the size of a Honda Ridgeline or Ford Maverick, I think truck folks (who skew conservative) would look at it a lot less derisively. There are entire swathes of the half-ton truck market that the Cybertruck simply cannot compete in due to a seeming fundamental misunderstanding by the design team of what the vehicle needs to be capable of and amenable to. This is especially evident in the fleet/work truck market where the unibody design immediately shuts out folks who need to put an aftermarket bed replacement (think plumbers, welders, and other trades).

It straddles the 1/2 to 3/4 ton segment in terms of specs, but it is fundamentally impossible to tow a 5th wheel or gooseneck trailer with a Cybertruck.

Again, there is "think different" and there is "misunderstand the market."

[–] dilap 1 day ago
Yeah, a swing and a miss for sure.
[–] latexr 1 day ago
> the amount of hate it gets when they are at least trying to push things outside of the normal makes me sad. The amount of negativity towards anything new that's not perfect is insane.

A significant portion of the hate they get is for what they represent and who they’re from, not because they’re “new” or “different” or “not perfect”.

[–] wahnfrieden 1 day ago
Not only was it not perfect, it was a total failure - they are stopping all production
[–] plagiarist 1 day ago
There is so much you are hiding behind "not perfect" and I think you know that.
[–] rdiddly 1 day ago
[flagged]
[–] dilap 1 day ago
You guys are living in a different universe. I can get hating Elon, but mediocre? Really? Completely absurd.
[–] rdiddly 1 day ago
I mean the things you acknowledge people hating him for probably overlap considerably with the things I'm thinking of when declaring him mediocre. To pick just one: Think of the boring CEOs who work hard to instill and drive an inclusive culture at their companies, and who make sure their people are treated as human beings. You haven't heard of any, because they're not out there trying to be an entertainment personality.
[–] oortoo 1 day ago
Outside of hoarding wealth, I haven't seen much evidence that Elon is particularly good at anything.
[–] dilap 1 day ago
What wealth did he hoard? His wealth is all in his ownership of companies he lead to great success.
[–] kattagarian 1 day ago
He just spend 400 million dollars on the election, half of this in texas alone.
[–] TheBlight 1 day ago
Doubt you had anything to do with that
[–] MOARDONGZPLZ 1 day ago
I’m an ultra lib, despise Elon, hope he faces a jury of peers to answer for all he has done, but this seems like learned behavior. My toddler son thinks they look really good (wife and I think they look atrocious and our anti-Elon bias doesn’t help).
[–] PorciiVorbesc 1 day ago
>My kids, and any friends of theirs riding with us, will boo whenever they see them on the road

Because adults around them groomed them for those actions. Kids don't just start booing at objects out of the blue, they parrot the learned behavior of the adults around them.

[–] andrewjf 1 day ago
Yeah we did
[–] vegan_because_i 1 day ago
kids do live in a society
[–] PorciiVorbesc 1 day ago
And the leaves move when the wind blows.
[–] giarc 1 day ago
My kids and their friends play a game where when you see certain cars, you do certain actions. Like "punch buggy" with VW bugs but with a bunch of different cars. Cybertruck is "cyberslap" and you get to slap someone when you see one.
[–] wodenokoto 21 hours ago
I live in Dubai. There is no lack of super cars on the streets. The other day a cybertruck was parked outside my window and this group of teenagers spend a long time posing in front of it taking group pictures and individual pictures.

You don’t see that with a Ferrari or Rolls Royce.

It is definitely going to be a collectors items, if it isn’t already.

That’s not gonna pay the bills for Tesla, but I guess it’s something.

[–] willis936 20 hours ago
You know what else you don't see with Ferraris? People lining up to spit on them.

https://youtu.be/L3oO510dyVI

[–] willis936 15 hours ago
The real deal in case anyone prefers literal spitting.

https://youtu.be/txb79zMKFv4

[–] PacificSpecific 1 day ago
Kind of like a delorean
[–] tyoma 1 day ago
I think this is exactly it. They are different and unlike anything else on the road.
[–] afavour 1 day ago
It’s certainly not exactly it because the Delorean has an indelible association with a classic film that’s beloved by many. It’s iconic without ever seeing one on the road (and most people have not)

The Cybertruck does not have that quality.

[–] fwip 1 day ago
And before that movie, the DeLorean actually had a very similar story - an expensive low-quality car that nobody wanted to buy, founder embroiled in controversy. The reason Doc Brown had the car in the movie was because it fit his image as an untrustworthy mad scientist.
[–] KerrAvon 1 day ago
Without BTTF it would absolutely be a minor footnote instead of a major one.
[–] marcosdumay 1 day ago
If any movie character gets a a Cybertruck in the next 20 years, it will be a villain, not a sympathetic hero.
[–] slowin 1 day ago
Except one looks like a sports car and the other looks like a garbage truck/can.
[–] mturmon 1 day ago
s/cocaine/ketamine/
[–] jesse_dot_id 1 day ago
There is absolutely no chance these will function in 30 years.
[–] darknavi 1 day ago
It certainly could, but likely very Ship of Theseus'd. I feel like enough of the parts are DRM'd hard by Tesla you'd need to Frankenstein the thing to do it.
[–] jesse_dot_id 1 day ago
The firmware will be a problem
[–] jms703 1 day ago
De Lorean status in the future.
[–] newspaper1 1 day ago
Definitely not, not only is the De Lorean a cooler car (by far) it wouldn't even be a collectors item if it wasn't in one of the most popular movies ever made. The cybertruck has the exact opposite associations, instead of being in a cool movie it's the pet project of one of the most hated humans alive.
[–] lkramer 1 day ago
Maybe there needs to be a new Back to the Future that uses them instead of a DeLorean:)
[–] mahboi 1 day ago
I know a teenager who got a Fisker Karma. Maybe he bought the dip.
[–] swang 1 day ago
no one is going to care about this in 30 years.
[–] hexagonsun 1 day ago
no way the batteries last that long
[–] richwater 1 day ago
I mean the 4680 cells are used in the model Y and the pack assembly isn't that complicated. I don't expect it to be financially ruinous to replace over time.
[–] orbital-decay 1 day ago
The software of a smartphone on wheels might be a bit harder to replace.
[–] howunfortunate 1 day ago
I mean if LLMs can do now what they do now, I doubt software will be much of a barrier for anything in the far future.
[–] MikeNotThePope 1 day ago
Will they work in 30 years?
[–] guywithahat 1 day ago
I can’t imagine why not. EV’s are generally more reliable than gas/diesel vehicles, and Tesla makes the most reliable EV’s.
[–] panzagl 1 day ago
I grew up on Big Trak, Kitt, and the Landmaster from "Damnation Alley". The kids are right.
[–] wahnfrieden 1 day ago
That's because adults taught them that behavior
[–] newspaper1 1 day ago
I think if you were to compare the cybertruck with other things kids like, you'd see that it looks like a hot pile of garbage. There's nothing about it that would attract a kid, it looks like a refrigerator.
[–] lettergram 1 day ago
I think there's a lot of kids (and parents) being influenced by politics more than pure ascetics.

The classroom of kids Ive seen (my kids attend 3 different schools), all of them are amazed by them - age ranges: 3, 7, 9 all their classrooms loved them. Same with some of the older kids I've been around. They're all boys, I do imagine it's a very boy-friendly car.

I personally don't have a cyber truck, not big on it personally, but never put my own opinions into my kids. The kids may not "like it", but they are amazed by it.

I'm in an area that doesn't really hate Musk, so I think that does have an impact.

[–] mahboi 1 day ago
I've never met or known a person IRL who cares about Tesla's ownership. I know people who hate Teslas cause they drive in the carpool lane or because they had bad experiences owning one, that's about it.
[–] dgacmu 1 day ago
You must have different kids than I do. Mine point at them and observe that they spotted another dumpster.
[–] trollbridge 1 day ago
I suspect you influenced them to feel this way.
[–] CharlieDigital 1 day ago
I have two girls; never mentioned Elon, Tesla, nor CT to them.

Both think it looks ugly.

No need to influence most people, IMO. Vehicles are shaped the way they are because the designs have broad appeal in general (familiarity? proportions? trends?). Most of us would find a normal, well-tailored black suit to be appealing and be baffled by avant garde, high fasion men's clothing.

Why should anyone be surprised that a completely novel design isn't appealing to most?

[–] throwup238 1 day ago
> Vehicles are shaped the way they are because the designs have broad appeal in general (familiarity? proportions? trends?).

Isn’t it mostly fuel efficiency standards and manufacturability? You’ve got a chassis that’s used for like five different models for five years between refreshes, not a lot of room to innovate without driving up all the costs so only the luxury cars can afford to look different.

[–] CharlieDigital 1 day ago
Most cars are and have been roughly the same shape for decades now. Rare innovations here and there, but largely still hold the same basic shapes across manufacturers and markets.
[–] mrguyorama 1 day ago
But that's part of it. Cars look the way they do because that is an efficient shape for something doing the job of "Car"

People who want cars to look different for it's own sake are saying they want worse cars.

Why? Why do those people need their cars to be shittier cars just to look different? What are they after? I bought a car as a toy, but it's average looking and not really special, and that doesn't have to actually impact how much I enjoy it. My previous shitty car was also very much enjoyed.

I don't understand the insistence that it looks "different" as if there is any virtue to a car design that was randomly generated to look different.

[–] faefox 1 day ago
That's just good parenting. :)
[–] seizethecheese 1 day ago
Do you think so? I'm not arguing here, I genuinely don't know.

My kids are too young for this, but surely there's a tradeoff here. Should you override some of your child's natural wonder because of adult aesthetics (or worse political concerns)? Yes. But how often? I'm not sure the line should be drawn at a truck design. (Although, maybe you're teaching your kid taste, again I'm not sure.)

[–] faefox 1 day ago
I was admittedly being a little facetious. It's not surprising to me that kids, especially kids who are at that age where monster trucks, construction equipment, the Batmobile etc. are the coolest things in the world would be drawn to the Cybertruck because it certainly does stand out and look larger than life in a way, like it was ripped from the pages of a comic book. I don't think there's any real harm in that, setting my own feelings about Elon and what he has come to represent aside for a moment. Let them enjoy the weird shiny thing while they're still too young to understand why it sucks. ;)
[–] gchamonlive 1 day ago
I wouldn't use disliking Cybertrucks as a proxy for good parenting. You can hate everything a symbol represents and still find the symbol cool, like I think motorcycle clubs are awesome but despise the toxic masculinity stereotype many reproduce.
[–] dgacmu 1 day ago
I suspect you're right. :) I think it's ghastly and poorly engineered/ designed.

14yo probably influenced -me- more than the other direction, though. That one has strong opinions.

This is the same 14yo who when she was younger would delightedly point out every Tesla (then, mostly model S's) she saw on the road. Probably still responding to both aesthetics and politics but it was interesting to see the shift.

[–] WillowWithAWand 1 day ago
Gonna let you in on a little secret:

Every parent influences their children. It's called parenting.

[–] apercu 1 day ago
Eh, even a 11 year old kid can see this thing is what a 5 year old kid thinks is "cool".
[–] jwineinger 1 day ago
Same. Mine like calling out "cyber-yuck!"
[–] stephencanon 1 day ago
Yeah. The kids I coach (1st-4th grade) generally call them 'stupidtrucks'.
[–] kevmo 1 day ago
My toddler saw one and got really excited "Look, Mama, a barn is driving!"
[–] soperj 1 day ago
yeah, my kids will call out, look another "Cyberbarf"
[–] mingus88 1 day ago
This theory backs up my opinion that every rich person who drives an exotic car is just an eight year old who had a Lamborghini poster on their wall growing up
[–] LatencyKills 1 day ago
I own a exotic car for the same reason I own mechanical watches. I love the engineering and craftsmanship. (But yes, I had several Lamborghini posters growing up) ;-)
[–] eqmvii 1 day ago
Yeah my 5yo falls in this camp and is resistant to nuanced political discussions about it FOR SOME REASON
[–] afavour 1 day ago
I suspect we’re going to discover a depressing future for today’s era of cars. 40 years from now will the Cybertruck software even let you turn it on? When will the last update have been? What servers does it communicate with that’ll end up long since decommissioned?

(FWIW my kids giggle at the Cybertruck and say it looks silly. In a sense they do love them but I’m not convinced they’ll long for one in years to come)

[–] danans 1 day ago
> Kids really love these things and get very excited to see them on the road

Unsurprising, as they look like they were designed by an 8 year old.

[–] settsu 1 day ago
> They are going to be very valued collectors items in 30 years

There's going to be 3 owners perpetually going to Cars and Coffee with theirs, rotating with their pristine Pontiac Aztec.

And that's all they'll do with it because there is no way a CyberTruck is going to last 30 years otherwise.

[–] polymork 1 day ago
You’re right kids really do love these things: that’s the entire target market.
[–] myko 1 day ago
maybe small kids i guess? teens in my experience mock them gleefully
[–] newspaper1 1 day ago
Every kid I've ever met hates Elon Musk, so I'm 100% sure that this failed product will not be a "collectors item".
[–] llm_nerd 1 day ago
> Kids really love these things and get very excited to see them on the road.

Do you have anything empirical to back this up? This feels like someone kind of hoping something is true. It's like the Harley rider sure that everyone thinks they're super cool with their super loud bike.

[–] howunfortunate 1 day ago
The Harley example is ironic because little boys are exactly the ones to find that cool
[–] llm_nerd 1 day ago
Little kids think crotch rockets are cool. Only the children of Harley owners think Harleys are cool. I mean, you understand there is a whole meme about this right?

In the same way that I'm entirely certain kids don't look at a monstrous mobile trash bin and say "wow, cool!". But the owners of those ugly abominations sure think they look cool.

[–] slowin 1 day ago
Every kid I know hates the cybertruck, they literally call it a boomer-mobile.
[–] SCdF 1 day ago
I'm sure they will hold value as Hitler's paintings do