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points by coloneltcb 1 day ago | 0 comments

My experience is the opposite. My kids, and any friends of theirs riding with us, will boo whenever they see them on the road

[–] ivanjermakov 1 day ago

Emotions from both ends of a spectrum are positive indicators of future's collection value.

[–] Grombobulous 1 day ago

Unless you’re Ferrari or Porsche, you don’t want to be in the situation where your vehicle has future collectors’ value. That usually just means it didn’t sell very well (rarity).

Let’s keep in mind that Tesla invested in this truck to be the next F-150, which is the best-selling vehicle in the USA for the past multiple decades.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago

You’re talking about different things. A failure from a manufacturer perspective can be a major success from a collector perspective (see also the DeLorean).

Even the hated Edsel is worth quite a bit today.

Of course it might be harder to keep a Cybertruck running for 50 years due to all the computerized components. Restorers will probably be relegated to rebuilding Cybertruck bodies with new components.

[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago

> Of course it might be harder to keep a Cybertruck running for 50 years due to all the computerized components. Restorers will probably be relegated to rebuilding Cybertruck bodies with new components.

Really no different than any classic car, really. GM isn't selling OEM parts for a '57 Chevy, for example. If you need replacement parts on those, nowadays, you're likely going to specialty manufacturers given there really aren't any "parts cars" around anymore.

[–] olelele 20 hours ago

For combustion engine parts all you need is metal work tools, not locked down proprietary software and electronics. My dad has a 1954 Citroen b11 that he’s kept alive and humming since he got it in the late 60s.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago

True, I just imagine that it will be harder for non-OEMs to make replacement electronics given how locked down Teslas are.

[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago

We'll have to wait and see. I honestly kind of doubt that will be true. There's all kinds of Tesla hacking that's been going on for years. It's possible to get a Tesla motor running without any external Tesla electronics through aftermarket solutions that carry support from the vendors.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago

I didn’t know that, that’s surprising, but I haven’t been following it that closely; I’ve just occasionally seen stories about Tesla shutting off service for DIYers. In that case maybe it won’t be so difficult.

[–] Grombobulous 1 day ago

I am talking about how value to collectors is irrelevant for most automakers.

Tesla’s corporate leadership would be much happier if the Cybertruck was selling 100,000 units a year and was not at all a collector’s item.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago

That’s not relevant to what the person you were responding to was talking about. They were talking about collectors.

[–] Grombobulous 1 day ago

And I’m talking about how their discussion of collectors is no consolation to the people at Tesla who were trying to make a mass-market profitable and successful vehicle.

I don’t have to talk about exactly what my comment parent is talking about in all facets. This isn’t a courtroom cross-examination.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago

Your comment is a non sequitur then. It reads like you’re just tacking on an irrelevant comment based on your personal feelings about the company.

[–] KerrAvon 1 day ago

In its time, the Edsel was more meh than hated. Mainly people didn't buy them because they were essentially pricier Fords and it was a recession year, and Ford threw in the towel for Ford-internal political reasons. The looks were not as much of an issue as people think today. It certainly didn't have the same political associations.

Good book on the subject: https://www.sup.org/books/history/disaster-dearborn

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago

Thanks for the clarification. My understanding was that the quality issues and exaggerated features drew a lot of mockery at the time. That’s not always enough to prevent something from succeeding (other polarizing vehicles like the Nissan Cube did OK) so the recession/internal politics angle makes sense.

[–] baggachipz 1 day ago

> Of course it might be harder to keep a Cybertruck running for 50 years due to all the computerized components

And all the well-documented reliability and quality issues.

[–] Grombobulous 17 hours ago

Considering the recent headlines about the decompilation and reverse engineering scenes, I doubt it!

If anything, the centralized control units of modern cars may make this sort of thing easier. A 2000’s car has more distributed pieces of vehicle control units (more similar to microcontrollers) while a modern EV built in the style of a Tesla has fewer compute components.

So in 50 years you’ll have some kind of recompilation scene where those computers get replaced, almost like how people replace their router software with OpenWRT or the people at vintage computer festivals who stand up reverse engineered AOL Instant Messenger services.

[–] iamnothere 1 day ago

That’s not such a big issue for restorers, there were also extreme quality problems with the Edsel.

[–] sejje 1 day ago

1990s F150s are selling for much more than their original new price, with low enough miles.

Best selling truck of all time. Not really about rarity.

[–] maxlin 1 day ago

Clearly this behavior is not original, but taught. Kids don't "boo" things out of nowhere. They are indifferent as hell to things on their own sure, but not a CB ...

[–] PorciiVorbesc 1 day ago

>Kids don't "boo" things out of nowhere

Not all HNers are good parents

[–] next_xibalba 1 day ago

Very clearly behavior introduced and encouraged by the parents, driven by politics, and not the merits of the object itself. Though it is an interesting commentary on the extreme, enforced conformity and politicization-of-everything we see in the world today.

[–] maxlin 1 day ago

Absolutely. I am sad for these kids and their families. This is not how you raise curious, open-minded children.

[–] NewJazz 1 day ago

What evidence do you see that "everything" is politicized? Elon was the largest single donor in the US midterm elections by far... Seems like he politicized things himself.

[–] plagiarist 1 day ago

If the Nazi salute wasn't political enough. Children going through WWII in their history classes might dislike Cybertrucks independently of their parents.

It's always an excuse and everyone else's fault that things are politicized. The same people telling us to leave every social problem to the Invisible Hand get fussy when it actually manifests.

[–] deepsquirrelnet 1 day ago

> The same people telling us to leave every social problem to the Invisible Hand get fussy when it actually manifests.

Yep. This is the world the Supreme Court handed us with Citizen's United. Now that money is speech, we all have to accept that when we buy things, our money can be used against us.

This is the world they wanted, and if you hate cancel culture, then you need to get on board with fixing the damage from Citizen's United... not raging against regular people who are doing exactly what they are supposed to do, and using their money as speech.

What you buy is your politics now. It fucking sucks, but look at it with clearer eyes.

[–] ryeguy_24 1 day ago

Totally, what kid would boo something without being preconditioned to hate it? Humans can never separate concepts in there heads. Either you’re good or you’re evil. Have news for you all, we are all both. Not saying I support that guys behavior, but he’s done some impressive stuff to further mankind.

[–] RunSet 1 day ago

Quite something how many posts here seem to default to "Those children who do not share my opinion, they must have been brainwashed. It's the only explanation."

[–] ryeguy_24 18 hours ago

I mean, fair point. But it sure does smell like the original commenter's kids have been brainwashed. "Booing" a car or having a hateful attitude towards a car without any external influence? I actually don't think the Cybertruck looks good - at all. But all my kids are amazed by it. And we haven't spoken to them at all about Elon.

[–] komali2 1 day ago

> and not the merits of the object itself

This is interesting to say given that by most objective measures of what constitutes a good truck, the cybertruck is a bad truck.

Edit: the stupid bed cover gets stuck when exposed to a not abnormal amount of dirt. In dry climates the thing shocks you every time you touch it. People regularly are slicing their hands open randomly on it. Body panels routinely fall off. Accelerator pedal getting stuck triggering recall. Shape of the bed making it impossible to actually carry anything normal and rectangular, 100 mile tow range when putting actual weight on it, bad visibility. I've seen some hilarious videos of them getting stuck in road conditions my Yaris could handle. I've even seen someone catastrophically damage the wheels by turning them left and right rapidly a few times.

A good truck can carry things in the bed and tow something a long way. It can drive on and off a dirty worksite without critical components failing or getting dug in or snapping an axle. Or ok fine, the Houston family truck special, it should at least be able to take the cooler and kids to the beach without getting stuck.

The cybertruck is not a good truck. It may be a good something else, status symbol or something, maybe it's comfortable to drive, I don't particularly care, it's simply not a good truck.

[–] next_xibalba 1 day ago

> objective measures of what constitutes a good truck

There is literally no such thing. But regardless, in this subthread, we are discussing the response of children to the pure aesthetics of the truck (or lack thereof) vs. the coached, politicized reaction to what it is claimed to represent.

[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago

There are plenty of objective measures of what makes a good truck. Payload capacity. Towing capacity. Towing range. Stopping distance when at GVWR. Stopping distance when towing at or Max Towing Capacity. Does standard lumber fit in the bed with or without the tailgate open. If it requires the tailgate to be open, does it provide factory installed tiedowns to be able to safely carry cargo with the tailgate open.

There are, of course, plenty of subjective measures such as NVH, amenability to modification through the aftermarket, total cost of ownership, offroad capabilities, etc.

From everything I've seen, some of which OP mentioned in an edit, points to the Cybertruck being a terrible truck seemingly designed by folks who have never owned/used a truck. And again, that is ignoring Elon's politics.

[–] sejje 1 day ago

No there's not.

> Payload capacity.

Fighting against truck size, MPGs

> Towing capacity.

Fighting MPGs, possibly diesel prices

> Towing range.

Only matters on electrics, everyone else goes to the gas station.

> Stopping distance when at GVWR.

I don't max my truck out, and I don't really think others should, either.

Anyway, maybe you can see that objectively, I'd rather have a Nissan Hardbody than whatever Superduty Diesel you have in mind.

[–] slowin 1 day ago

Or, it's just objectively ugly and cringe, which it is.

[–] alt227 1 day ago

Nothing about design or looks is objective. Lots of people like the design. Dont assume your opinion is objectively 'right'.

[–] slowin 1 day ago

No, it objectively failed. That's why they are not going to make it anymore. "Lots of people" do not like it.

[–] plagiarist 1 day ago

N64 graphics vehicle.

[–] pfannkuchen 1 day ago

Sure but kids don’t generally boo at ugly cars, they just don’t really notice them.

[–] slowin 1 day ago

I think the cybertruck is orders of magnitude uglier than any other vehicle, so I think it's an expected response.

[–] dilap 1 day ago

Old enough to be haters, I guess.

Mostly I've seen younger kids love it. I was at the park and a little girl saw a Cybertruck pull up -- "Look, Dad, it's from the future!"

I think Cybertruck is probably ultimately a failure, but the amount of hate it gets when they are at least trying to push things outside of the normal makes me sad. The amount of negativity towards anything new that's not perfect is insane.

[–] AshleyGrant 1 day ago

Look, there is "trying to push things outside of the normal" and then there is "completely misunderstanding the purpose of a half-ton truck." I say this despite that fact that the Cybertruck, from a size perspective, it straddles the line between half-ton and 3/4-ton, and it is a complete utter non-starter as a 3/4 ton for several reasons.

If the CyberTruck were the size of a Honda Ridgeline or Ford Maverick, I think truck folks (who skew conservative) would look at it a lot less derisively. There are entire swathes of the half-ton truck market that the Cybertruck simply cannot compete in due to a seeming fundamental misunderstanding by the design team of what the vehicle needs to be capable of and amenable to. This is especially evident in the fleet/work truck market where the unibody design immediately shuts out folks who need to put an aftermarket bed replacement (think plumbers, welders, and other trades).

It straddles the 1/2 to 3/4 ton segment in terms of specs, but it is fundamentally impossible to tow a 5th wheel or gooseneck trailer with a Cybertruck.

Again, there is "think different" and there is "misunderstand the market."

[–] dilap 1 day ago

Yeah, a swing and a miss for sure.

[–] latexr 1 day ago

> the amount of hate it gets when they are at least trying to push things outside of the normal makes me sad. The amount of negativity towards anything new that's not perfect is insane.

A significant portion of the hate they get is for what they represent and who they’re from, not because they’re “new” or “different” or “not perfect”.

[–] wahnfrieden 1 day ago

Not only was it not perfect, it was a total failure - they are stopping all production

[–] plagiarist 1 day ago

There is so much you are hiding behind "not perfect" and I think you know that.

[–] rdiddly 1 day ago

[flagged]

[–] dilap 1 day ago

You guys are living in a different universe. I can get hating Elon, but mediocre? Really? Completely absurd.

[–] rdiddly 1 day ago

I mean the things you acknowledge people hating him for probably overlap considerably with the things I'm thinking of when declaring him mediocre. To pick just one: Think of the boring CEOs who work hard to instill and drive an inclusive culture at their companies, and who make sure their people are treated as human beings. You haven't heard of any, because they're not out there trying to be an entertainment personality.

[–] oortoo 1 day ago

Outside of hoarding wealth, I haven't seen much evidence that Elon is particularly good at anything.

[–] dilap 1 day ago

What wealth did he hoard? His wealth is all in his ownership of companies he lead to great success.

[–] kattagarian 1 day ago

He just spend 400 million dollars on the election, half of this in texas alone.

[–] sejje 1 day ago

Spending is the opposite of hoarding

[–] dilap 1 day ago

He doesn't seem very politicallly...effective.

But anyway, I don't think it's fair to say he "hoarded" wealth. It's all from ownership in companies he led, or selling stock in said companies. It's not like, I don't know, post-soviet Russian oligarchs or Carlos Slim or something, who you could all reasonably say were hoarding wealth.

[–] TheBlight 1 day ago

Doubt you had anything to do with that

[–] MOARDONGZPLZ 1 day ago

I’m an ultra lib, despise Elon, hope he faces a jury of peers to answer for all he has done, but this seems like learned behavior. My toddler son thinks they look really good (wife and I think they look atrocious and our anti-Elon bias doesn’t help).

[–] PorciiVorbesc 1 day ago

>My kids, and any friends of theirs riding with us, will boo whenever they see them on the road

Because adults around them groomed them for those actions. Kids don't just start booing at objects out of the blue, they parrot the learned behavior of the adults around them.

[–] andrewjf 1 day ago

Yeah we did

[–] vegan_because_i 1 day ago

kids do live in a society

[–] PorciiVorbesc 1 day ago

And the leaves move when the wind blows.