If inflation is too low or doesn’t exist, then there’s less incentive to do anything with your money. If I have bunch a money that I don’t need to spend immediately, and I just want to keep it secure, why would I not keep it in a safe or non-investment account if it’s not losing value over time? What’s my incentive to risk it by lending it out to someone else?
Sure, I could say that my incentive is the interest rate, but my alternative is zero risk. Inflation turns “zero risk” into being more like a certainty of slow value loss, so that holders of capital are incentivized to do something at least minimally risky with that money (e.g., lend it to the government in the form of treasury bonds or deposit it into an insured bank account).
Debt has something of a bad reputation and obviously it can be overused and abused, but it’s also something that helps the efficiency of economies. It maximizes the amount of money actively participating in the economy rather than sitting.
[–] bigbadfeline 15 hours ago
[–] spwa4 14 hours ago
Could you explain? If you work. You're not renting. You're not on a pension. You're not ... then what is bad about inflation?
[–] bigbadfeline 14 hours ago
Work or no work doesn't matter, inflation steals everyone's savings, wages grow slower than inflation - so they get stolen too, it causes a run on assets, feeds on itself and feeds corruption-driven bubbles, the funds extracted via inflation lead to monopolization and oligarchy-zation, inflation can be used to install Hitlers and manipulate elections, the list goes on.
> You're not renting. You're not on a pension. You're not...
Right, if you're not living, inflation doesn't matter, in all other cases it does. I don't know what you are talking about here or rather, I know that you don't know what you're talking about.
It's crystal clear that you have no idea what the role of banks in the economy is and what it's supposed to be. Without that understanding you're going to keep presenting pompously mysterious arguments which are nonsensical even by the low-bar measure of mainstream economics. I cannot type a whole econ 101 course here, you're supposed to figure out on your own why we have banks, how they work and what they're supposed to achieve.
[–] spwa4 13 hours ago
Luckily working people's savings are essentially nothing and you have a wage. Which means it won't affect poor working people. But yes it will destroy savings, which is why it hurts rich people and doesn't hurt poor people: the rich have savings you and I don't have. The rich have savings the state does not have.
Wages grow slower than inflation - that's the point, the government would shortcut this by overpaying, so that wages would grow at the pace or even faster than inflation.
> to keep presenting pompously mysterious arguments which are nonsensical even by the low-bar measure of mainstream economics ...
Still have my original (1970) economics textbook. This is what it says should be done. Explicitly raising inflation to 10% or so helps poor people by destroying their debt, and it hurts every kind of savings in the economy, which is why rich people don't want it. It equalizes everyone.
Besides I don't understand why you're even making this argument. Neither the US nor EU governments will balance the budget. Both are ~4 years off from the point where they will need to pay back more than they can lend, in other words, the point where NOT having something like 10% inflation will directly hurt their budget. And then they'll do what every big organization does when hit in the budget: do whatever to increase inflation. And if the government tried to cause inflation ... it's easy. Very, very easy.
In other words: you can't stop it. I can't stop it. One of 2 things will happen: either governments balance their budgets NOW or 10% inflation will happen. Since the idea of a balanced budget is laughable, that only leaves option 2.
[–] bigbadfeline 11 hours ago
Lucky them, due to inflation constantly eroding their incomes, they can't save. I repeat, wage growth trails inflation, see housing and everything else.
> Which means it won't affect poor working people.
Untrue, as I've explained twice already.
> But yes it will destroy savings, which is why it hurts rich people and doesn't hurt poor people: the rich have savings you and I don't have. The rich have savings the state does not have.
Untrue, rich people don't have savings, they have properties and investments, inflation is how they acquire more of them, the poor are forced to sell cheap to survive, the rich swallow it all.
> Explicitly raising inflation to 10% or so helps poor people by destroying their debt,
More falsehoods from you - poor people, poor on collateral, borrow small amounts all the time, think payday loans at rates rising with inflation and several times higher than the rates for the rich - inflation does help the rich who borrow large sums at long intervals but it doesn't help the poor at all, for them, it's more inflation -> more wage erosion -> more (and more expensive) debt. You can't outrun your shadow, do you understand?
> and it hurts every kind of savings in the economy
It doesn't hurt the assets of the rich because they appreciate faster than inflation, especially if you include their siphoning of more assets due to the financially depressed poor.
> which is why rich people don't want it. It equalizes everyone.
The falsehoods are getting out of hand. The rich have vastly more debt than the poor, they borrow against their appreciating assets at vastly better interest rates and longer terms, so the more inflation - the less they repay, they love inflation more than anything, it makes them richer. If you're incapable of understanding my words, hear an authority with experience - by Trump's words: "Inflation made me very rich"
> Still have my original (1970) economics textbook.
Shoddy econ books are a dime a dozen. Give me the author and title, I love to make fun of sloppy econ books, there are so many of them, so much fun.
> Besides I don't understand why you're even making this argument... You can't stop it
Finally a sensible argument, kinda, as much as inevitability can be an argument. However, I'm not trying to stop inflation, I'm analyzing its systemic origins with an eye on systemic fixes. If it can't be stopped this time around, we should not allow it to happen again. Besides, I want to explore all options.
The risk of missed purchases isn't zero and the risk of missing investment profits isn't zero either. From motivational point of view, inflation and deflation aren't different, they're the same thing in a mirror image.
Deflation is rare as hen's teeth, harmless and extremely easy to fix. Inflation, on the other hand, is the most corrupt economic phenomenon by far, it's hard to fix and it has ruined numerous economies, caused wars, destruction and famines.
> Debt has something of a bad reputation and obviously it can be overused and abused, but it’s also something that helps the efficiency of economies.
This is a strawman, nobody said debt as such was bad. However, since you started, let me correct you - as it is, debt not only "can be overused and abused" - it is routinely abused and overused and inflation is a huge part of it.