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points by black6 3 days ago | 0 comments

Why is it so hard to admit that there is a cultural (and, by extension, racial) component?

Because in a large number of cases, people are conflating economic situation with culture or race. And many of these so-called cultural or racial components disappear in the "home" country when you look at people in the middle class and above. Just like violent crime rates drop massively for those same races and cultures in the country they have immigrated to when they gain economic independence.

It's quite possible that high levels of immigration of unskilled or otherwise unemployable people is a bad thing for a country that shouldn't be allowed. That is a very different thing than acting like the reason it is a bad idea is because of their culture or race.

[–] lukan 3 days ago

Of course there is one, but what exactly is "immigrant culture"?

That is my problem with the whole thing, all just gets thrown into one bag "immigrants". The women assaulting islamist gets the same label as the homosexual atheist fleeing where they are in charge. (And never mind that the bible contains mostly the same bad passages as the quoran and I never done the numbers, but I assume if we count and plot "muslims killed by non non muslims vs "non muslims killed by muslims" - that number would not match the felt reality)

[–] ifwinterco 3 days ago

Acknowledging that contradicts liberal ideology, which is the closest thing most people have to religion in modern western society.

It's not merely a bit controversial, it's heresy

[–] AlexeyBelov 2 days ago

Because it's not true in general. You've written a couple of meaningless statements just to signal something.

UPD: looked at your other comments... wow..

[–] ifwinterco 1 day ago

If what I write is meaningless why bother reading my other comments?

[–] snapcaster 2 days ago

It's our religious belief (or closest thing to it) and overall it's adaptive. It's like asking a Christian why it's so hard to not just admit god isn't real. There aren't many monoculture ethnostates doing great right now and they're pretty much all on the path towards extinction given current fertility rates

[–] CamperBob2 3 days ago

Why is it so hard to admit that there is a cultural (and, by extension, racial) component?

What does "by extension" mean? Culture is voluntary. You can (and should) walk away from a flawed culture. Race is an unsheddable fixed attribute.

Meanwhile, both culture and race see more variation within groups than they do between groups, making discrimination a losing proposition even aside from its inherent immorality.

[–] mythrwy 3 days ago

"You can (and should) walk away from a flawed culture."

To a limited extent as an individual. One can't simply remake the entire world they were born within.

[–] FiniteField 3 days ago

>both culture and race see more variation within groups than they do between groups

Btw, the premise underlying this fact is a fallacy. It is the norm for population groups, even meaningfully differing ones, to have "more internal variation" than between groups.

There is more variation in height within sexes than between them, but despite this there is still a very (statistically and culturally) significant difference in average height between men and women.

It's even possible for two distributions to be completely separated by a given variable while still having more internal variance.

[–] CamperBob2 2 days ago

The fallacy comes into play when you use those characteristics to prejudge individual humans.

Tall women are taller than short men, so if you're hiring a librarian who needs to be able to reach books on a high shelf, you still need to look at the individual. Society as a whole suffers if you run employment ads saying "Women need not apply," so we rightfully deter that.